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No PUDS in HMB

There's no question that property rights are a hotly debated issue here. In just 2 weeks, thsese 2 posts have gotten almost 400 comments, pro and con. This has divided our community for a long time and will continue to do so.

Property owners also over the years have seen their rights reduced by questionable zoning regulations, restrictive easements, higher fees and endless appeals. The big developers are not deterred by these tactics and fight back and win. The small property owner doesn't have the deep pockets to fight City Hall and basicially just takes it.

Well maybe there's hope. Perhaps we can create a ground swell support for property owners to fight back and reclaim what is theirs. Let me introduce you to NP3 and is legion of Property Rights Crusaders (aka PUD Busters) with their chant "No PUDS in HMB" and their colorful logo.

This is really bigger than the PUDS (Planned Unit Developments). Its about how the system has treated people like the family on Terrace and their 6 year battle, a restaurant owner spending a year to get a permit, a 60 year HMB resident told she can't expand her home 1 sqft, conflicting zoning for a doctor who built our hospital, 1800 homes re-zoned, etc. Remember many of these people have owned land on the Coast for decades, long before the surrounding neighborhoods have been built. They didn't stop your homes from being built because of spralling growth. Why are we stopping them?

Perhaps if this logo appears in large numbers at City Council meetings and other agencies throughout the Coast, our elected officials will start to see that property rights do matter and they need to make changes.

Please feel free to use this logo as you see fit. Hopefully, this will start to change things.


Comments

Desperate Realtor advertising alert!


What's your point: that he doesn't have a cushy government job where he can spend his days on the internet?


Recently I have been so happy to see for the 1st time in years the people of HMB starting to work together for a common goal of finding ways to solve the Beachwood problem

And then WAM! along comes Hyman with his ridiculous inflammatory charge of "Ego Terrorism"

As Imoan pointed out above ^this is all about Hyman's publicity stunt Hyman is making a mountain out of a mole hill.

He won't be happy until he has the national news media convinced we are just a bunch of vigilante Coastside terrorists lobbing pumpkins and dirt balls at each other

It is obvious he is trying to carve out a niche for himself as defender of the poor down trod developers who have unbuildable lots for sale

This publicity stunt might make him some money But these negative TalkAbout threads are costing the Coastside home owners Money on the value of their homes

As all this talk of Ego Terrorism by our so called Review Real Estate Expert is required to be part of the Disclosures when selling a property

PS. Today let's all try and be positive as we look foreword to new beginnings.


Excuse me...but...wasn't there something else a little bit more important happening today?

(Gosh, whatever could that be?)


OSM, you continue to make statements that aren't borne out by the facts. None of the property owners I represent either in the area in question or elsewhere can anyway be classified as "poor down trod developers". Most of them bought these lots decades ago before many surrounding areas were even developed. They hoped to retire here and build their dream houses. In several cases, health issues, old age or death changed their plans.

I'm also puzzled over your statements that my commenting on TA "has cost Coastside homeowners money on the value of their homes". In the brief time I've posted here, I'm not sure what I've said that has made values decline. If you look how the Coast has performed versus San Mateo County in total, the exact opposite has happened. For all of 2008, Coast average home prices declined by 7% to $965,000 compared to the County which saw a 14% decline in average price to $1,038,000.

If anything, the extensive real estate coverage I've given the public here over many years has made them more informed than their counterparts over the hill.

Anyway, this thread isn't about me, its about property owners here and how the system has treated them. Pointing this out is good for everyone. I'm sorry if you don't like people developing their land that they've paid taxes on for decades but the solution is very simple. Buy it.


This is all about a realtor lobbying in a for free public forum to change the zoning of a parcel he has a real estate listing for.

On this day, when our new President calls on us to be responsible, it's clear some haven't gotten the message.


I'm not sure what I've said that have made home values decline"

All your resent blogs and posts about Eco Terrorism and pending bankruptcy and cheap shots at our City Council and City Hall

Have a combined effect of stopping prospective home owners from wanting to reside here

Your negative comments about HMB are 'significant' and seeing how you are a HMB Real Estate broker

Your opinion should now be apart of the real estate disclosure package

Ask yourself who would buy a house in HMB after reading all Hymans negative posts?


OSM - what YOU are doing is "ego-terrorism" since the whole thing is putting yourself down through your absurd comments. Mr. Hyman has been speaking of "eco-terrorism" and it has been largely for humor. At the same time, the PUD thing is an outrageous denial of the rights of property; can't you see that? Most of us are on the side of the little NP frog and we aren't watching the "coronation" because we have to work for a living. Somebody will have to pay this huge "rebate" of taxes to those who haven't paid taxes...maybe we'll start with some of the new administration members?


What's humorous about Terrorism?

You kiddies really need to get out more.


You seem to mis-state what I've said so let me clarify things for you.

Back in 2000, I wrote in the Review that this endless litigation could have dire consequences. $10+ million later in legal fees and a $41 million judgment, I was right.

I agreed with the settlement and supported first AB 1991 (the $0 option) then SB?? (the state handout). For over 1 year I have been in favor of selling off assets to reduce the debt burden. I have been against the appeal, BK, the bond, and City raises.

You, on the other hand, were against the settlement, for the appeal and BK. The only area where we might have agreed was on the City raises.

My views have been positive (considering the ugly hand we were dealt) for the City and correct. Your views have been ruinous, wrong and you won't seem to stop until you've destroyed our town. If anything, we should disclose doing business with the likes of you is bad because you don't have the City's best interests at heart.


Didn't the 44th City Manager look splendid riding with me in the new Green Bus on Main Street during his inagrual?


You can make fun of these PUDS all you want but when you see all that vacant land up and down the Coast, remember people own it. And its only a matter of time till these PUDS move front and center. Whether its with NP3 and the NO PUDS in HMB campaign or something else, its going to happen.

And because our City foolishly almost self-destructed over the crushing Beachwood debacle, the next battle will be much easier since we won't have the money to put up a big defense.

Beachwood was the wrong battle to shoot our financial wad on. Properties off of Alsace Loraine, Arleta Park or Frenchmans Creek will hold more homes and with what money are we going to fight them? They are also ocean front properties. People like Tony and Tom are patient and persistant. This will happen.

So maybe you saved Beachwood from the Grim Discer but you won't be able to stop these cause we won't have any more money. And everybody knows it. That will be your legacy.


Steve, didn't you hear and understand the president of the United States in his inaugural address? YOURS in a crumbling paradigm. End the greed, contribute to the common good. Otherwise be swept away by the winds of destiny.


I don't equate my helping people in their most important financial transaction as greed. I would also say that my years of free public service educating the Coast about real estate and issues that effect them contributes to the common good.

But if you are saying that land owners are greedy and should donate their property for free so that they can contribute to the common good, then I would say that is a highly unlikely scenario. Perhaps it is the City that should contribute to the common good of its citizens by ripping up these punitive policies and give out free building permits as just compensation. They could start tomorrow by doing that to the family they unjustly punished on Terrace Ave.


Great attitude and love the frog. Go kick some pud today Steve.


Watching said:

"What's your point: that he doesn't have a cushy government job where he can spend his days on the internet?"

ha!

But, in reality, which of the masses of 24/7 posters to TA has "a cushy government job where he can spend his days on the internet?"

Certainly not realtor Steve Hyman. He has a private industry job where time is money and not to be wasted on the internet.

oh... wait...


Uh oh, starting to rain. Better sharpen the discing blades on the Green Bus. Don't want the weeds to grow in the PUDS.


Please give those babies a good haircut NP3. We can't afford anymore wetland weeds here. If I lived in Half Moon Bay, you'd get my vote. I agree discing is beautiful.


Too much time on your hands, Steve.


I see the schoolyard boys are still circled up and pounding the PUDs. You have to wonder how this is going to translate into commissions for the most ardent among them.


Mr. NP3

Can you please explain on thing for me? If Railroad Row was owned previously by Open Space and than sold to the City, doesn't that make these particular PUDS inaccessible period?


OK Steve or who ever, this old guy needs an explanation of how PUD's hinder or help? Been in HMB since 6/69 & then the bureaucrat's decided to substandard me. Sorry i ever voted for "you cant do that" Coastal Commission didn't realize that they would get into everything!. "No you cant scratch your butt more then 3x a day" It's environmentally incorrect. Never again will i vote for a bureaucracy no matter how good it sounds.

OK now that i ranted How do PUD'S hinder or help. Am i for them or against?


The Railroad ROW goes from Magnolia to either Kelly or Miramontes. But you will find land on the Coast through Miramar and even Montara where homes today were built on the abandoned Ocean Shore Railroad tracks. Its actually interesting and will show up on title reports for certain homes. It does raise a few eyebrows when you see it.

I'm a little sketchy on all the facts but the City bought several parcels and took their land here for $3.7 million and then sold it to the HMB OPen Space and created a conservation easement. The City also bought for $500,000 a lot on Kelly next to a current CC member's home and placed a conservation easement here too. In effect they created a 50 foot wide easement to further restrict access to 100-200 properties that were already burdened by the restrictive PUD zoning.

These properties aren't landlocked because access is available by a few streets that run parallel to Railroad off of Poplar. Also a few lots are east of the ROW on streets like Central, Correas, Garcia, Miramontes and west of the last homes but are part of this PUD.

My feeling is that this large expenditure of money was done to further burden all these property owners by adding one more huge hurdle to overcome. There are an x-mayor, x-planning commissioner and current council member who live here and had input in the creation of this. I have trouble coming up with a positive reason as to why this was done to all these long term property owners.

I have asked several times for another reason for why we spent $4 million dollars for a 50 foot wide strip of dirt but all I get are personal insults and attacks.


The question is should you be for or against PUDS is an interesting question.

First you need to know that these PUDS are all over the place in HMB. They go from north of Ocean Colony (N Wavecrest) to before Pullman in Miramar on both sides of HWY 1. Some PUDS have hundreds of lots and others have as few as 3 lots. They also have different restrictions on them. You've heard me mention in one 50 acre PUD of 8 parcels, the City specificially said the only house on 3 acres in this PUD could not be expanded by 1 sqft and if burnt down can't be rebuilt. Why would our City punish a 60 year resident like this?

It made the home very hard to sell and significantly reduced its value by a few hundred thousand dollars. The City did offer some relief by trying to buy this 3 acre parcel and home for $250,000 when it had another offer for $800,000. Guess which offer the owner took?

So should you care? When you think that there are several hundred property owners who were treated poorly by their City. How long will they take this abuse? Its only a matter of time till this issue comes front and center. These are prime properties unlike Beachwood, with most being ocean front so eventually the drumbeat will get louder.

It is easier and cheaper for the City to deal with this before it gets raised to unpleasantness. The City is not financially in a position to take on more battles.

Its possible Open Space organizations may buy these to preserve the views but that will take a lot of money. Last sale on Correas for a 6500 sqft lot was $90,000. Do the math, that's a lot of money.

I know people are focused on Beachwood and the $18 million payment due in June (and rightfully so) but this is another dark cloud looming on the horizon. Something needs to be done because zoning people's property into nothing without compensation is not ok. That's why these posts hit a raw nerve and why I created the NO PUDS in HMB to help right the wrong. We'll see where this goes. It is not going to go away.


Steve,

Planned Unit Development zoning is sometimes used to accomplish various land-use goals. An example of this would be to create higher density housing on a large site, so that other portions of the site can be used for different purposes.

I suggest that you learn more about this topic in relation to site planning and zoning.


Bingo. At least some of the PUDs in HMB were created to facilitate development in chunks rather than a bit at a time.

That's why it is now amusing to see advocates of unsustainable overdevelopment railing against them and trying to promote (commission-associated) sales of properties in them as properties that will inevitably have their status changed one day.


While the whole of HMB is busy talking Tsunami!

Hyman talks White caps and commissions.


I agree with you resident that some PUDS were created to create higher density zoning like the 3 acre home by Frenchmans Creek. The lots in Arleta Park/Alsace Loraine area have already been chopped up into 6500-7500 sqft lots many decades ago so they are ready to be built on like the other homes in the area now.

But since you seem to be knowledgable about PUDS, perhaps you can give me a reason as to why the City paid all that money to put a conservation easement in front of these lots and how that benefits the property owners. I would sincerely like to get an answer to this. Please respond. Thanks.


Steve, just as a reminder, and point of reference, every single current Council member vowed through promise that they would produce the long awaited LCP Update. To this moment, not one page has been viewed, let alone changed, deleted, or enhanced.

For those that might be unaware, the Local Coastal Program/Land Use Plan (LCP) is where we find our zoning codes.

The next Planning Commission meeting was cancelled, just as one of the two the month prior. Guess there's nothing to do.


"...perhaps you can give me a reason as to why the City paid all that money..."

The made-up $4 million? Or some other number you pulled out of your hat?


Come on np, can't you answer a simple question. Why was a conservation placed on the Railroad ROW and how does it benefit all the property owners in this PUD? The reason for the easement is the question. The amount spent is just another example of wasteful government spending.


What amount? The $4 million you made up to dramatize some goofy attention-seeking ploy? Are you this cavalier on all figures associated with properties you represent?


I know for a fact about the $3.7 million. A friend of mine was involved in the purchase. I don't know if Grady's lot was included in that or additional. But you still didn't answer the reason for the conservation easement and how it benefits the property owners. That's the question so please try and focus and answer it.


"I know for a fact about the $3.7 million. A friend of mine was involved in the purchase."

In other words, hearsay. Maybe you should double-check with your "friend" for actual figures. With the properties you list, aren't you bound by a code of ethics of some sort to be accurate and realistic with your numbers? Why should you be any less so here. Makes you look like you can't get anything right.


If you can't answer my question about why, I don't know if I'm going to be able to play with you anymore until your meds kick in. So please focus and answer this. WHY WAS THE CONSERVATION EASEMENT PLACED HERE AND HOW DID IT BENEFIT THE PROPERTY OWNERS?


Steven,

If you can't even get a few numbers in the single digits correct, what hope is there of engaging you in a meaningful dialog on the value of open space and green belts in communities? Maybe it works for selling real estate to and for gullible, trusting types; but here one wants to know if you can get the meanings of words or a few simple numbers straight. First you can't define "eco-terrorism" or give any actual examples of it; and now you can't support a single number you are trying to use to hype a petty, contrived tirade associated with a property you are trying to sell.

By the way, getting any feelers on Tony's lot as a result of all this piddle?


"There you go again". But sorry, I'm done playing with you. Have a good evening.


In other words, when it comes to facts, you are not to be believed. Well, we established something tonight, after all. Get back to us if you learn anything, will ya?

And good luck flogging those properties on message boards. Looks like 2009 is going to be a pretty miserable year unless you specialize in selling foreclosures to bargain hunters. Trying to parlay fear over the mess the city got into on Beachwood into a loosening of restrictions and regulations throughout town will probably have to wait for another time.


All caps equal screaming. Please stop doing that.


Agreed,"Trying to parlay fear over the mess the City got into with Beachwood into a loosening of restrictions and regulations through the town will probably have to wait for another time"

Ya you should try selling your non conforming red herrings latter on

Right now the City of HMB has bigger fish to fry.


OSM, we actually agree except that sometimes we have to walk and chew gum at the same time. It is uncertain as to when this issue will rear its ugly head but rest assurd that it will. Its usually better to difuse things early rather than let them explode.

People like Tony and Tom won't be patient forever. Especially when no one can give a better reason as to why the City willfully placed a conservation easement on this area. It would be a sad situation if the reason turned out to restrict access in addition to the questionable PUD zoning. I must have asked this question 15-20 times and no one wants to address it. That's bad.


Steve - I couldn't resist doing a brief Fact Check on some of your info. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong:

0 Correas MLS: 80819571 is an Active listing, with a List Price of $95,000.

Because it is not Sold (according to MLSListings.com), the actual value of that parcel has not been determined.

During the past 12 months, 30 parcels that are zoned for Planned Unit Development have sold in the city of Half Moon Bay.

The Average List price for these parcels was $8,197 and the Average Sales Price for these parcels is $6,660.

There is a significant difference between your 0 Correas list price and the 12 month sales history of land that is zoned for Planned Unit Development in HMB.


While the listing you mentioned is correct, although I didn't verify the MLS number, there have been sales on Correas and the adjoing side ztreet that is ocean front and butts up against the coastal trail. I sold one on Correas for $90,000 in 5/07 and one on Pacific and Central for $76,000 in 8/07

There have been a lot of sales in the N Wavecrest area that have gone for a lot less. Tha area, as I have stated previously, is going to be almost impossible to develop because of the sale to POST of the adjoining area.


Steve- I couldn't resist quoting Now Pitching from an hour ago. . . . . .

"Ain't you bound by a code of ethics of some sort to be more accurate and realistic with your numbers"

Well ain't you?


Quoting np can be dangerous since he's the master of avoiding the question (one of the few things he's actuallly good at). The Railroad Ave purchase price was a figure told to me by someone directly involed in the transaction in a face to face conversation less than 2 weeks ago. Other figures I used like the sale of PUDS here are taken from our MLS and are sales I was directly involved in.


Doesn't anybody want to try and answer why the City put a conservation easement on the Railroad Ave ROW? 3 past and present City officials live on Metzgar, Filbert and Kelly. This was done for a reason. Why? Why? Why?


Poor Steven still trying to find were all the bodies are buried on Railraod?

So he can drive the last financial nails into HMB's coffin

Hay don't ask city hall they are still trying to find their way through the revolving door to the bathroom.


Steven. M.F. & J.G. and others. You are right! Hey, I understand that the FBI has an advertisement on political corruption. No statue of limitations of the theft of public funds!


OSM, you keep getting things wrong. The reason the City has so many nails in their financial coffin is because of the cheering from the peanut gallery from you and others to keep wastfully spending untold millions on lawsuits like Beachwood, Pacific Ridge and N Wavecrest. Had a more reasonable approach been taken like what I suggested back in 2000, we wouldn't be where we are now.

I'm suggesting in these posts to head off another potential problem before it becomes a big and expensive one. That's not only a logical approach but a fair one considering what the City did to its residents a long time ago.

And I'm still waiting for someone to give another plausable reason why the City placed a restrictive conservation easement on this 50 foot wide strip of dirt. Surely, the x-mayor, x-planning commissioner and current council member must have some idea. Afterall, they live within a stones throw of it. Very strange.


I prefer the dog food Advertisement.

Ya know the one were the dog never seems to get tired of chasing cars up and down the road.


You got these guys on the ropes Steve. Look they are reduced to dribble. They can't answer a simple question. Let's bust those PUDS up!


Hyman can't even get the simple records of the purchase prices for the public property he is questioning. So simple. The figures might even have been reported in the Review. But he would rather throw out an erroneous figure in his quest for attention, a figure much too high for extra drama.

When the city purchased the parcels, the reason was given. Does Hyman bother to look this up? No, he would rather play Brian and ask questions about what has already been answered.

Looking at all the repetitive errors and stonewalling on the process of acquiring basic information, one must ask if this would be the person to trust with a sale of property or for representation on the purchase of property. Can you just imagine this guy being responsible for all the disclosures that must be done nowadays? If information is not correct in those disclosures, which you as a seller must sign or initial, you can get into a world of hurt.


He's just chasing his tail. He's desperate. We've known all along, since FDR, that unrestrained self interest is immoral. Now we can see, once again, it's bad economics. A new day is dawning, Steve. Catch the wave.................


"There you go again and again" np. You rountinely find it impossible to answer a simple question but just dodge it and respond with your usual long-winded irrelevant insults. So childish and boring.


Have you had an offer on this lot yet?


You guys keep missing the point. This isn't about me or my selling a lot. Its about how property owners have been relegated to 2nd class citizens and abused by restrictive and questionable abusive zoning regulations.

The views you have supported have been a massive failure resulting in wasteful spending and a crushing judgment. When you've been so wrong for so long, your opinions have no credibability. Just like the little boy continually crying the weeds are coming. We've turned off your volume.

But the issue here is about PUDS and what should we do about them. That's the question so take you ridalin and please try and focus. Lets try and have an intelligent discussion.


Mr Hyman: You are wasting your time with these dweebs; you end up being like Demosthenes trying to speak over the sound of the ocean. You are trying to educate the stones; you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. We of the silent majority know what you are talking about and clearly see your point; it is the loud minority (of about two and a half individuals) that don't get it and don't want to get it. They are prisoners of a failed ideology.


Tick, Tock. Time is slowly passing, and the leaders of HMB are expressing surprise at the harsh assessment in the recent audits, yet some also admit that they knew all the risky fiscal situation two years ago.

My question is//// what does this city propose to do about the $18M elephant in the room?

George Muteff had a quarter page ad in last weeks HMBR with an idea to save the city from decades of repaying a huge bill. Mr Muteff has proposed this idea of "redefining wetlands in accord with the LCP definition" many times before.

The response from the city is snoooze.

Tick, Tock.


Any offers on Tony's lot this evening? You'd think there would be some action with all this free promotion the property is getting. Looks like the property rights crowd doesn't come through when a seller needs help. Come on righties, get those wallets out. Or has Hyman botched the paperwork with innaccurate information that is scaring away buyers?


Steve created and lives in this thread, yet we've failed to hear from him on whether or not he's had an offer on the lot.

HAVE YOU HAD AN OFFER ON THE LOT? WHAT DON"T YOU UNDERSTAND?


"There you go again and again Steve. You rountinely find it impossible to answer a simple question but just dodge it and respond with your usual long-winded irrelevant insults. So childish and boring." Just answer the simple question: Have you had an offer on the lot?


Not only is it inaapropriate for me to comment on anything until its a done deal but its also inaaproriate to use this format for advertising.

These heavily viewed posts are about property rights and PUDS. That point seems lost on all the ADD kiddies in the HMB peanut gallery.


You are right wemoan. They are dweebs. They have nothing to add but their ADD.


What's wrong with you guys? For families that have to deal with it ADD is a real issue. Next thing you know you guys will be calling each other "retards". Grow up.


Sorry if I offended you about the ADD remark. It does get frustrating when trying to have a meaningful conversation to be asked repeatedly 20, 30 times silly questions like "do I have a lot for sale on Filbert & Railroad or do I have an offer yet".

There are a few posters who do this to irritate people while adding nothing of substance.


NP and OSM have been called worse!


Dave B - if you could see some of the postings that have been erased by Clay....then you would know how many people REALLY feel about the infamous and deservedly horribly maligned NP. It ain't pretty.


I'm a little surprised that I haven't gotten any comments on the logo. In case you're wondering, the NP3 frog is a digitized version of the one on my sign that was purchased from a shop on Main Street and painted red. What do you think?


Love the logo. Funniest thing I've seen all week. Do you have this in better format? Steve keep it up, you are great!


Did that logo help bring in offers on Tony's lot during business hours today? Or are even the property rightists turned off by a seller's agent who does not know the meaning of terms he freely throws around and can't even look up simple sales figures for a couple of pieces of property for which he broadcasts false numbers?

Hyman seems to have some friends. For gosh sakes, why don't you buy the darn lot and provide him with a little commission to get by on during these down times for sales?


NP! Such an idea! We could, in your honor, make it a home for wayward frogs; maybe we could throw in a sheep or two,just so you can enjoy the bleating and remember those romances of the gay old days of your youth.


Wemoan,

I'll bet Hyman won't care what your fantasies are as long as you pony up an offer and deposit for the lot.


For those wanting a better version here of our Property Rights Crusader NP3 and No PUDS in HMB, not to be confused with the wild pitching and off subject np, please contact me off-line and I'll email you a jpeg.

If the demand is there, I'll make t-shirts or signs with part of the proceeds going to help pay the Keenan tab (less 6% commission of course). This will make a nice and colorful statement at Coastside meetings.


Mr Hyman,

I have been reviewing the city's zoning documents and am providing you the link on PUD so that you can show me what specifically should be changed. If it is not the words, what is wrong with the process? How did the Gales 6 year quest get so mucked up? Sorry, I tried, but I do not know how to do the link, but just go to hmbcity.com and zoning.


Lisa, what's wrong with the PUDs is that from what I've seen based on properties I've been involved in is that they are all different for each area. Some PUDS have a few hundred properties and some have single digit.

I still can't figure out why one of my clients in an 8 parcel PUD of 50 mol acre area was refused the ability to expand her home by 1 sqft when her's was the only house there. Why would the City write such an ordinace for 1 specific home? Another PUD I have listed is a 3 parcel PUD part of a large nursery and theis 3 acre parcel is zoned for multiple homes on 7500 sqft lots. Try and build multiple homes here and you'll have another huge battle.

The PUD where Tony's lot is in needs approval from all the 100-200 owners to do something plus building roads and infrastructure for all the lots. That's a tall order. Its also further complicted by the City putting a conservation easement there blocking access to these lots.

The Gale family was not in a PUD but showwed how a few obstructioists can tortue a family for years both emotionally and financially. This was a disgrace. To compensate this family, the City should waive all permit fees as a small way of apologizing for their behavior.

One way to get around the PUDS is to do what the developers did in N Wavecrest, which was a partial PUD. They were able to put together their plan while ignoring the other landowners.

These PUD ordinaces are arcane and punitive and should be thrown in the garbage heap. NP3 is dieing to sink his teeth into those thick ordinances and chew them up. If this sounds confusing, it is and its not right.


Have you had an offer on this lot yet?


Just answer the darn question: DID YOU GET AN OFFER ON THE LOT?


I had no idea that redudantly repeating onself caused by inhaling too much wetland weed is so contagious and widespread on the Coast. As stated in WebMD, the only cure is to rub McDonalds special sauce on your body, roll around naked on a For Sale sign for 60 minutes or pay a real estate commission.

I don't know if McDonalds has enough special sauce or I have enough For Sale Signs to deal with this growing epidemic. Luckily, I have enough eco-friendly recylced purchase contracts thanks to NP3 discing all the PUDS. You guys better act quickly because the next stage of this disease gets really ugly can can only be cured by weed-boarding. Take the cure or you'll end up like little np. The Coast can't take two of these babbling bozos.


Look in the mirror, bonobo.


Mr Hyman,

How can we fix the PUD in HMB before it is too late? What can I do? How do I get a T shirt? or a jpeg file?


Did the Friday evening hours produce any feelers on the lot? I'm beginning to think Hyman's antics on behalf of Tony's lot aren't reaching the right people. Oh well, there's always the weekend. Will a bona fide Realtor be conducting an "open lot" on the property?


Lisa, fixing the PUD problem is going to take time. First the City has to hear the ground-swell of support for change. These posts may be the beginning of this movement. Then they will fix the zoning ordinances.

We all know the CC is consumed with finding the Beachwood solution but there are other issues that need attention too.

Contact me off-line and I'll email you the logo like I did for Dave B. I'll also let you know about t-shirts.

While some have ridiculed me for this, the facts tell a different story. So far on all 3 posts over the past few weeks these have generated almost 600 comments and 6000 views. Just since Tuesday, over 900 people have seen the No PUDS in HMB logo. My first post was the 2nd highest commented one on TA and the highest one by someone using their real name.

As I said before many times, property rights issues are a big thing here and aren't going to go away. Maybe NP3 and his battle cry with your help will be just what's needed to get the CC's attention.


Mr. Hyman

Property rights isn't really a big issue for me, because like everyone else in this Community, we have a "mutual respect" for property rights.

What I'm more concerned about is the value of my home, and you aren't helping with proposing another lawsuit for your City, and carrying on about PUDS, no one knows what they are................

Why not compare property values to the City of San Mateo? You would have a very different outcome than comparing us to the Co. of San Mateo. I know for a fact prices are slightly down, and they are still receiving multiple offers in the City of San Mateo.

As for Railroad Row, many many So. Calif Beach Communities have used these strips for welcoming public access to the Coast. Every single human should be allowed access to the Coast, it just doesn't belong to those of us who are fortunate enough to live by the Ocean.

As long as LAFCO has put us under the "sphere of influence" with HMB, I'm looking for leadership.


I'm glad to hear that you have respect for others property rights but that's not the case here for everyone. That's why we have had all the expensive problems with litigation.

And while all property owners are concerned with the value of their homes, etc, my commenting about abuses over the years isn't the problem.

If you are curious how both the Coast, HMB, San Mateo and the County did in 2008 verus 2007, glad to give you the data from our MLS. I think you'll find the statistics different than you would have thought. HMB average price in 2008 was $,1075,000 and down 5%. Coast was $965,000, down 7%. San Mateo was $923,000, down 13%. San MAteo County was $1,038,000, down 14%. So you can see, we did better than our neighbors over the hill.

I realize most people have never heard of PUDS and what they are, which is part of the reason I'm doing this. But of course if some little np wantabe didn't knock down by sign a few times, these posts never would have happened. 6000 views in 3 weeks shows there's a lot of interest.

And while under different circumstances a 50 foot conservation easement for 5-6 blocks might be nice. But here a few hundred yards away is the bluff top Coastal Trail that is much wider, partially pved, on the ocean and goes for miles from the Ritz to the Harbor. This was an unnecessary expenditure that was designed to restrict access to the property owners.

So to those who say, my comments are impacting your homes value, I'd say you are right. My information over the years is helping you outperform other areas so how about a little gratitude.


The Hyman bleat goes on. But what we all want to know is whether or not, and in spite of all his erroneous numbers and misuse of terms, he is getting any action toward selling Tony's lot on Railroad Avenue with all this free publicity. The guy is obviously desperate for a commission and at a loss as to what to do to perk up sales of his listings, so someone, anyone, give him a call and help him out.


All this attention I'm getting from you np is making me nervous. It seems you must have a crush on me. Whatever you do, please don't send me a video of you rolling around naked on a For Sale Sign as you try to cure your endless repeating. Somehow, I don't think you look like Heidi Klume but more like Homer Simpson.


Very disingenuous, Mr. Hyman. Your transparent bleating for attention has not escaped the notice of many people. We are concerned for you and sincerely hope all the off-the-wall whacko rhetoric turns up a buyer with a kindred soul and a pocketbook that allows you to ease up on your desperate quest for a commission from sale of Tony's lot.

So, how did it go today? Any lot buyers show up to relieve your anxiety? Weekends should be a better time for you, with people coming to the coastside who don't know about your trouble with definitions and purchase price figures.


Mr. Hyman:

Are you an Urban Planner or expert in Zoning?

Are you professionally qualified to offer a public opinion on Site Planning and Zoning?


One does not have to have a degree in public administration to read these zoning ordinances. For example, why would the City write specificially in one of the PUD ordinces that the only home in an 8-9 parcel PUD can not be expanded by 1 sqft or that a second home can be placed on the property when it has 3 acres of land? Also why would the City write into the ordinance that if this home burnt down, it couldn't be rebuilt?

This is an example of zoning runing amuck or Police Power Brutality.


Most Realtors that I know do not offer professional opinions on subjects for which they are not qualified. You're neither Lawyer nor Planner.


Resident, using your faulty logic, you are not qualified to comment on things I say being that you are most likely neither a real estate broker and franchise owner of a real estate company.

You also don't know what I know so why would I put much weight on what you think. Last time I checked this is a free country where we can express ourselves as you seem to do as well.


Steve, you got a lot of guts dealing with all this abuse and these meatballs. These guys never had a useful comment just insults. Go for it with NP3. Bust up the PUDS.


Mr. Hyman thanks for the detailed work on these restrictions. My family owns land in a pud near the nurseries for over 30 years. We were never informed of these changes you say took place 20 years ago and its been very hard to sell. The City ripped my family off. Glad to join the campaign so my kids will get something out of this someday. I have enjoyed your advise for years.


A PUD is a Planned Unit Development.


Mr. Hyman:

I see that you still have not corrected the false and misleading language on your Active Listing MLS #80833066 at 0 Filbert St.

(from Web Link)

"...THIS IS AN OCEAN VIEW CORNER LOT ON A PAVED STREET LOCATED AT FILBERT AND RAILROAD..."

This is a false statement and is a violation of Article 2 of the Realtor code of Ethics:

Article 2

REALTORS® shall avoid exaggeration, misrepresentation, or concealment of pertinent facts relating to the property or the transaction

Web Link


I think the frog is very cute and I'm still laughing over the NP3 story. I'm also glad to see the green bus in HMB because we didn't like it up here. Go PUD Busters.


With all the inane blather about eco-terrorism, frogs, PUDs, city purchases of property, wetlands, etc., what the people really want to know is whether or not the babble is attracting potential buyers to the lot on Railroad Ave. We know Hyman needs the commission, and he is making a lot of noise about the property, so is this Realtor's TalkAbout approach working in these tough times for property sales?


Just answer the frickin question Steve: HAVE YOU HAD AN OFFER ON THE MISREPRESENTED LOT? And btw, stop using MY NAME to advertize your shizzle.


Resident, I appreciate you bringing that matter to my attention. Thanks to you, I not only fixed that comment but was able to update some of the photos to highlight a close up of my full company For Sale sign and and our Property Rights Crusader, NP3. Now it will be visible on all the top real estate search engines for millions to see.

You can ridicule me all you want but I'm thrilled that 6000 people have viewed my posts since January 11th. PUD POwer is growing. Don't you feel it?


Web Link

Yeah, I think I feel something under my tail. Could you check it? I can't see back there.


Thank you Resident,

Another pertinent one for you, lots more to follow. . .

Realtor Ethics

Standard Practice 12-5

Realtors shall not advertise nor permit any person employed by or affiliated with them to advertise listed property in any medium (electronic print radio television) without disclosing the name of that realtores firm in a reasonable and readily apparent manner.


Steve, thanks for educating me about PUDS because I never heard of them before. Np, thanks for educating me on nothing because in all yyour insulting posts, I learned nothing. The frog is cute.


Annette, right on all points. The stupid insults from these guys is amazing.


Well I'm one of those 6000 views on the posts. Actually, I'm more than that as I have viewed it several times. When things get hectic around my house I can click on and it brings a smile to me when I realize that there are "adults" more immature than my 3 year old. I smile because she is more mature than these guys posting. How embarassing.


I never heard of PUDS before but I already hate them. HMB should stop screwing with people. I guess some people have to learn the hard way. Go frogie go.


PUDs were once the darlings of developers and Realtors hereabouts, a way to help justify some desired developments in bulk. The whining now is because some PUD requirements are getting in the way of newer schemes for different kinds of development. One should never forget the development and real estate sales industry is short-term in its money-grubbing outlook and, consequently, does not feel responsible for longer timelines on which human lives are led. Their attention spans are not long enough to be able to see and cop to their hypocrisies.


End of the business day on Monday. Any action on the sale of Tony's lot as a result of weekend efforts or the ongoing babble today?

After all this publicity and no reports of interest, I'm beginning to think it is a dog of a property. Probably way overpriced for what it is in today's market. But I'll continue to keep hope up that Hyman's desperate attempts to get attention will result in something for him. Even Realtors have to eat.


HMB should stop screwing with people's lives and land. If HMB wants the land, buy the land. Oh, didn't HMB spend all its money on lawyers? Silly me. I guess the people should just give it away for free because that is the nice thing to do? Yeah right!


Who said HMB wants the lot Hyman is trying to sell? Keep your eye on the ball. This is about unloading Tony's lot and producing a commission for Hyman. All the rest is a cry for attention in service of that.


What is your problem NP? I find this interesting, except for you. If this is about Mr. Hyman trying to make a sale, this is a stroke of genius. I'm doing something this year and I will use him because I like his style. Very clever and funny.


Steve, I'm sorry you get all this abuse trying to help people. You are a funny guy with thick skin. I still love the frog he is so cute.


So, Bernie and Annette, what are you going to do to help Hyman out of his embarrassing misery? Are either of you looking for a lot on the west side?


This is a beautiful area. I would be afraid some crazed view protector would burn my house down. I saw it before in El Granada.


"This is a beautiful area. I would be afraid some crazed view protector would burn my house down. I saw it before in El Granada."

What did you see, Annette? Someone burning down someone else's house to protect a view in El Granada. Please, tell us the facts so we can learn to see things your way based on your knowledge.

In the meantime, I'm sure Hyman will be very diligent in trying to protect your rights and property if you decide to offer on the lot on Railroad Avenue. Which you should do to help Steven. Just check all of his paperwork with your own representative, in view of his problems with numbers and definitions.


Does the Beach House ring a bell Mr. Negative. They never did catch that eco-terrorist!


One more thing, Mr. Negative. Steve gives so much useful information. You, on the other hand, wouldn't know how to use a fact if it hit you in your big mouth. So much talk, so little substance.


Oh my, Annette, you know who torched the Beach House? And it was an eco-terrorist? Details please, because no one, including ATF agents investigating the incident for months, could come up with the information you claim to know. It would be very interesting to learn how you eliminated all the obvious other interests who had a gripe with the construction of the Beach House--not that anyone can say any one of them did it either.

It will be so good to get your information, because it solves an open-ended crime and will allow several law enforcement agencies to close their books on it. And we all will know you actually know something and are not just blowing gas.


Mr. Negative, so much talk, so little substance.


Gee, Annette, don't you have anything to back up your eco-terrorist bluster? We had high hopes for you as a crime-solver, and now...nothing. Someone new to the coastside might have imagined you knew what you were talking about with your accusation. Just think of their disappointment now unless you can come through.

Meanwhile, no word on Hyman's listed lot on Railroad Ave., so you might still have a chance to take it off Tony's hands.


Like none of the people out partying on the strip while the beach house burned knew anything about the fire.


Why would you say they did? Just another anti-environment dolt blowing gas unless you can come up with something.

I was sorry I missed that party; but it may not have been so much fun anyway when you consider firefighters or some itinerant huddled up for the night could have been hurt or killed. I hope the arsonist hired by the builder (for the insurance money), or the union or non-union interests going in and out of their separate gates, or the subcontractors who got to do their work and get paid a second time after the fire, or the developer/builder trying to lay a crime off on environmentalists, or the working harbor interests being squeezed financially by the reshaping of the harbor area for upscale tourism, or the business enemies of the developer, or the firebug, or the eco-terrorists, or any of a number of others who might have been involved in the crime thought of that.

Sorry the crime didn't solve out the way the simple-minded overdevelopment crowd wanted. But, hey, don't hesitate to get in touch with the authorities if you have new insight on it to offer.


And I always thought NP stood for "Now Pitching" - now I realize it stands for "Negative PUD"..how appropriate. NP, you are letting a little more of your enviro-extremist nastiness show from under the white sheet of anonymity, tsk, tsk. Were you playing your fiddle while the flames engulfed the Beach House? Well, NP, remember how that emperor ended up...


Of course these posts started a few weeks ago with destruction of personal property and the extreme measures taken to mimimze repeated attacks. While obviously not as extreme as the torching of the Beach House and its celbrated destruction, my sign went through the same thing. People will be pleased to know that both the sign and its securily attached defender of your property rights, NP3, has now withstood 2 weeks of scrunity. And with the thoughtful comments of another poster, NP3 and my full company sign are now posted on all the major real estate search engines for millions to see.

But the real question here is what do you think about PUDS and what should the City do about them? A few posters repeatedly try to redirect the dialogue with irrelevant and stupid insulting remarks that fall on deaf ears. These are just weak wild pitches that don't even reach the plate.

So should the City dust off these old ordinances and look at them again and see if they are still relevant and fair to the hundreds of property owners? In just 1 week, despite all the attention to the Inaguaration, this post and the cute No PUDS in HMB has gotten 1300 views. PUD Power is growing. Don't you feel it.


Had to check out this sign with all this attention. Steve, you actually screwed that frog into the big post. To funny for words, great sense of humor. love it. While there, a woman came by and her dog took a dump in front of it which she didn't remove. Guess that's what the conservation easement is for-good use of HMB money. Made me think of NP, it stands for Now Pooping for how he fouls Talkabout.


Dave, let me return the compliment. No Pooping is very funny and appropriate. NP does foul ta. We should always refer to him this way because his opinions stink. You should give credit to Steve for the No Pooping phrase because he mentioned it in his last post. I think this would also make a great sign.


"You can ridicule me all you want but I'm thrilled that 6000 people have viewed my pasts since Jan 11th"

Hmmmmmmmmmm!

Standard of Practice 12-15

Realtors shall not advertise nor permit any person employed by or affiliated with them to advertise listed property in any medium (eg. electronic print radio. Television ect) without disclosing the name of that realtore's firm in a reasonable and readily apparent manner.


Thanks for the friendly advice Cat but I'm not advertising anything here. I am talking about property rights and the abuses residents have had to put up with here. Please read both my opening statement and what I said on 1/23. Others like resident and now pooping are trying to change the subject but I won't play their silly games or yours either.


As I said before Mr. Hyman, my family got screwed with this pud zoning years ago. Sorry to here people complainig about dogs dumping on their land but I got horses crapping on mine. All that manure is probably becoming a breeding ground for the pud frogs. Where I'm from, these guys legs make good eating. Catch enough and its a good meal with some garlic and JD. Now I'm getting hungry so maybe I'll visit my pud and catch a meal or two. Bust those puds up. I'm sick of all this pc crap.


Another beautiful day on the coast. Is all the PUD-pounding by the Realtors and the Old Guard brass monkeys producing some new feelers on the lot Hyman has listed on Railroad Avenue? Surely all the anti-enviro babble must be attracting potential buyers to Tony's lot with its custom sign?

How about an update on sales action on the lot, Hyman? We'd hate to think after all this bleating about this and that using terms you and your buddies don't understand and numbers you make up that all you managed to accomplish was embarrassing yourself. Tony can't wait forever, you know.


Just like you pud hater, my dad bought a bunch of these for me and my sisters 30+ years ago. We tried doing something around 10 years ago and were told to forget it by some clown in city hall. No one told us nothing over the years. Now my dreams are shattered so someone can have their dog or horse crap on my property. What an outrage. Whose this No Pooping guy he can't be for real can he? I'm so mad I want to sue!


Tom,

Don't waste another day. Get on over to Half Moon Bay and list your disappointing PUDs with Steven Hyman. Who knows, he may even start a whole new off-the-wall sales thread on TalkAbout on behalf of your land. Not bound by the usual rules of veracity, or even arithmetic, Hyman will be ideal for gaining attention among the gullible for your dead-weight pieces.

Of course, Steven can't give you any guarantees concerning actual sales. He has been able to report precious little in the way of action on Tony's lot, but maybe he is just trying to protect the feelings of the other Realtors in town who are less successful in the ways of the NAR. At the very least, your new business will allow him to continue to amuse himself and the collection of like-minded simpletons in town, so your moribund lots could be considered a public service in his hands.


Is this guy for real and why all this hatred for Hyman or whoever he is? Seems like a smart guy to me. No wonder HMB got so screwed up because they listened to clowns like this. Used to be a great little place 30 years ago now its run by nuts. Good luck, you'll need it.


I see you're in a different community. You're a quick study.

You know, Tom, every family has their rejects. Now pooping is one of ours. Just realize that he's a victim of too high a nitrogen content in his drinking water and ate a lot of lead paint when he was younger.

We are embarrassed, but what can we do? Just show some understanding, if you can.

"I'm so mad I want to sue!" All I can tell you here is litigation seems to be the only thing this City understands. They sure should, they have loads of experience with it. Take a number and climb in. The water is shallow and warm. Perfect way to spend your free time. Btw, when you win, please be sure to stop and have lunch, fill up your tank, and enjoy a cocktail or two before you leave town.

Give a little back as they say.


Dear Tom,

I don't run anything. We are really concerned for poor Hyman, having to resort to goofy TalkAbout promotion for properties listed with him. The guy obviously is chasing commissions any way he can, and no one hates him for his desperation. We feel sorry for his type in our difficult little town. You can help. Make an appointment, hop in your car, and git on over to Hyman's office to list the properties that so disappoint you. Whatever you get out of them would be better than only having frustration from them.

Did you hear about home sales nationally the past few months? Things are moving on the low end. Many people are snapping up foreclosures and other properties being dumped. Put a proper price on your deadbeat lots and Hyman will get commissions from some sucker while you and your sisters score enough for a six-pack or two.


Yes, Tom, this "Now Pitching" person is for "real." Does not live in Half Moon Bay, however. No one "listens" to them, that is why they are so angry.


Poor Brian, so sad his hopes for "property rights" domination of HMB aren't going so well with Keenan's Beachwood settlement in trouble and government subsidies for wrecking the town, such as AB 1991, failing to come through. But with his short little attention span and untroubling lack of knowledge about local matters, he won't fully realize how bad he is doing and will come out feeling okay after all.

Please don't get down on Brian if he perceives the amusement he provides to others as anger. His confusion is part of the fun.


Despite your obvious afflictions, we still love you NP. We feel your pain. It's going to be alright.

If you are going to be banging your keyboard, you should look at one of your bills. Check the address. It always helps if you could at least start off telling the truth. You do have bills don't you? Or are you in such a state that others take care of that for you?

Credibility starts with the truth. Try it. You might like it.


The lack of respect for people continue here. Incredible people walk their dogs an have them turd on private property or the scenic railroad row. Horses turd on private property to. What the hell. Pick up your turds. Don't leave them for others to step on. I know its nature but gross.


This is becoming to funny for words. NP=Now Pooping, love it. Serves the jerk right for picking on Mr. Hyman who's just trying to talk about a serious matter. Turds on conservation easements and some guy wanting to eat pud frog legs washed down with Jack Daniels. I'm so glad we spent millions on this so we can scrape the crap off our sneaks. I didn't know puds before but I really hate them now. God Bless HMB.


The attacks just keep on coming on Tony's lot. I thought 230 pounds of concrete would be enough to secure the 4x4 post against most assaults. Now I hear from Dave that people are turding in front of Tony's lot. Not only is this tresspassing but there must be some City ordinace about leaving gifts like this on someone's property. (I'm sure Now Pooping will illuminate us on that). But what really concerns me is that this toxic turd could seriously undermine the large hole I dug. I'm thinking I'll have to go out there this weekend and reinforce it with another 100-200 pounds of concrete. I'd hate to see NP3 fall from some turds.

PUD POwer is growing. Can't you feel (and now smell) it?


Publicizing poop! Never would have thought of that as a sales technique. But we are talking a HMB Realtor here, and things don't operate the way they do for normal people. In this case, the feces fit.

Steven, let us know if the unhealthy, stinky approach works for generating potential buyers for the lot on Railroad Avenue.


Now Steve, take it easy on our poor, scorned and reviled Negative PUD or is it Now Pooping? All of the bleating sub-simian mouth breathers are getting the upper hand and he might come and burn down your house. This may cause a genuine uprising of the W.W.F.L. (wetland, weed and frog lovers) with the great NP in front of the pack, waving the red flag of revolution. His eyes red with rage...or is that from inhaling too much weed?


Ya gotta chuckle at Wee wemoan, afraid of his/her own fear-mongering and incapable of an original thought that might help him/her out of the self-confining mental cage. Kind of like the ape reduced to throwing poop at zoo visitors.


pooping on puds. we spend millions for open space so dogs can crap on things. another great investment by mayor mike. thanks mike, you're like the gift that keeps on pooping.


Hey Babe, ya gotta love that ol' NP; I really love the endless repetition of the same old shopworn expressions - "fear-mongering". What "fear mongering" was there in that previous entry, NP? I'll bet you used to love to go to the zoo just so the apes would do that to you..is that when you started being a bottom feeder, so to speak?


Do your homework and try to get to bed early tonight, wemoan. Your friends are pooping on puds, and I'd like you to be spared the imagery so close to your bedtime.


While this is an amusing twist and one that couldn't have been anticipated, it would be great to get back to the original questions. What should we do with the PUDS, up or down? And what do you thing of the No PUDS in HMB logo?


Steven, giving up on the scatological sales angle so quickly? Just for the record, what made you abandon it? Local Realtors look to you for leadership on such matters.

I get the feeling another day has gone by without a commission from Tony's lot. Best wishes for a real buyer tomorrow.


Mr. Hyman you've given me the best laugh in days and an education too. Glad to answer your questions. Down with Puds, down with poop and dig the frog. Thank you.


Now Pitching - the epitomy of a scatophagus parasite.


Steve, like Bernie no on puds, no on poop and yes on froggie.


My sister raised a rabbit named Tammy as a 4H project. It was a shock to us kids when we became aware of the full extent of Tammy's diet. Makes me feel better to know Tammy has since gone on to become an expert on coprophagy.


Have to agree with you again on everything Annette. PUDS stink, Poop stinks and the logo is cool. Glad to hear other pud owners speaking up. One more thing, NP stinks too.


NP,

I think you are talking about corpolites, so that should be corpophagy. the study of fossilized crap is a science. Believe it or not, I had to pay an archaelogist to dig and look for corpolites before I could proceed with a minor addition in the county.


My family got screwed by these stupid pud laws. We hate puds and the idiots who wrote them. Fix it now. I'm glad to see others are also angry. The horse crap is over the top.


One more comment. Are the idiots who made the pud laws the same idiots who caused the big lawsuit?


pud hater: I think you are on the right track. Get out the tar and feathers! I am not sure they are all living locally other than the Great Mike who is occasionally seen around Safeway when he ventures forth to buy victuals.

Lisa: such lunacy only happens in places like this one where the inmates are running the asylum.


Pudhater, the idiots who laid the pud zoning on you are different than the idiots responsible for the lawsuit on HMB. Our weather here is good for growing big pumpkins and dump leaders.


Yes, the Great One seems to have his silly little white hat pulled down more over his eyes probably so the outraged public doesn't recognize him; tar and feathers would burn like hell and be tough to clean up.


I demand more studies of coastal corpolites! Fossilized Feces Unite! Web Link Even though it is clear that this county and the CCC totally revere corpolites, we need to spread this mania to the hinterlands. Forthwith and evermore, praise doofus dung, fossilized feces, and coastal corpolites. Surely, this "Movement" will stop all development better than mere frogs and snakes. Corpolites are about the history of crap. What better place to begin this campaign than along our coast, where we live at ground ZERO. Plus think of all the new Jobs for archaeologists and their new "digs".


Dave, you seem to have this placed figured out. Why not run for MCCC? We could use a sane person!


Annette, thanks but no thanks. Love to see the Sups take the MCC and take them to the dump along with the HMB CC. Can't you see we aren't fit to run a library check out counter. Down with PUDS and the putzs too!


"Glad to hear other pud owners speaking up."

Annette has a pud? Does she pound her pud in public like Dave B?

"I think you are talking about corpolites, so that should be corpophagy."

Nope, it's coprophagy. Ask Tammy.

"corpolites"

Not right, either, though it has nothing to do with Tammy's dietary preferences. Our thread-bunny here does not eat rocks. Nothing a little remedial paleontology couldn't fix for lisa and Coastal Corpolite. Just to help jump-start their education, it's "coprolite."


I apologize, it is corpolite...


Just goes to show, not all Now Pitchings are created equal, though I don't really mind idiots with no knowledge of their own stealing my name or some variant of it. It's part of their schoolyard games and provides an outlet for their ignorant prattle.


If you need a reference go to Web Link


Gee, it's not often one of my juvenile shadows corrects himself/herself. This isn't going to set well with your little circled-up buds.


Reading all this makes me feel HMB is full of nuts and whackos. Seems you guys are more messed up than Berkley and that's toough to be. That NP guy is the most messed up of all. I guess that sums up the sad state of HMB.


Which NP guy? There are several, you know, so you'll have to deal with what is said rather than playing with name taunts.


How can a place be so screwed up! You can't be for real you need some idiot studying crap to build a home. My pud has horse crapping on it for decades. After all this time with flies and frogs hardened in it, some joker is going to say this is from the godzilla period or something. You guys are beyond help. Down with puds and the morons who made them.


"Down with puds and the morons who made them."

The thought of you learning how and why PUDs became established in our area and by whom delights me.


As I recall, the topic is PUDs-- I dont like em-- And as far as crap (or coprolites) , dont like em-- town politics, dont like em...

Is there anything else?


Mr. Negative. Do you ever make a point or state a fact? It seems many people are learning of puds and now them them. You add nothing to the conversation but mean comments, so immature.


Hey, don't get after me, if that is who you are directing your comments to. There would be substantially less overdevelopment now in HMB if PUDs had not been created as part of the rationale for development. All we are doing here is having fun with a Realtor who is using a PUD inconvenience as part of his attempt to get attention for a lot he is trying to sell. As he is all for cramming in as much development as possible everywhere in town so there will be more to sell and produce commissions for him, he would never have been against PUDs as a pro-development methodology for tracts of land when most were created years ago.


Eureka!!!! I found a place where I can make a great living in a nice but crazy place. My mama told me to study teeth but I dug dung. I'm moving tomorrow to HMB. What a beautiful combination dung and puds. I'm in dung heaven.


Mr. Negative you are sounding defensive and defeated. Steve is winning with his brillant idea. PUDS getting you down?


"Mr. Negative. Do you ever make a point or state a fact? It seems many people are learning of puds and now them them. You add nothing to the conversation but mean comments, so immature."

Annette,

Please do not get after Hyman like this. All of his misused terms, erroneous numbers, and environmental ignorance are merely part of his goofy attempt to get attention for his business and the sale of a particular lot he has listed. Real estate sales are slow these days, so a Realtor has to try whatever they can, even if it is retro-weird and out of touch with reality. Just look at all of Steven's friends in ignorance--you would think one of them would help him out with a little sales action, wouldn't you?


NP, what is wrong with "sales action?" NP, of course supports "no action". The more decline the better. Dismal swamp, the ideal.


"Steve is winning with his brillant idea."

No sales action on Tony's lot, so all the trumped-up PUD sideshow has been a failure so far.

It's really sad to see some in the real estate industry abandoning their old PUD friends now that they have become an occasional inconvenience. The hypocrisy doesn't do much for trust in Realtors, and that can't be good for getting those commissions.


sales action,

Hey, that is what these threads bleating for attention to Steven's listing on Railroad Avenue are all about. You have to feel sorry for what he must resort to, lacking any more responsible or fruitful sales techniques, and we all wait for his report of a successful sale of Tony's lot. For playing along, I'd suggest we all should get pizza at It's Italia courtesy of Steven when the lot sells, but I don't know how dire his financial straits are these days. Could be pretty bad given his obvious flailing and desperation.


The more you pick on Steve, Mr. Negative, the more popular he gets with his clever use of NP3 and PUDS. He set you up and you fell into his trap. You're as easy to read as a comic book with big pictures. You're jnot funny but mean.


It's okay Annette. Some day you might get beyond the comic books and a whole marvelous world of creativity will make your past look like childish play. I feel good thinking about how much you might discover.


Ok, I have arrived. No need to continue to listen to NP. Enough of his comic books, childish play, and doting flailing and desperation. Time is nigh. Show down.


These PUDS are starting to piss me off. Hard to believe something I new nothing about a few weeks make me so dung mad. Down with PUDS and the morons who made them. Go froggie, kick some PUD. While youre at it kick NP too.


I'll take a large sleek mountain lion in my neigbhorhood over your stupid looking frog any day. You coast destroyers are so incredibly shallow, stupid, and self-destructive. Hoooooooo! Hooooooo!


Annette: You looked better in your mouse ears. Not so good in a bikini. At least these days.


Messiah,

George is not going to like you trying to steal his desired role. But I welcome you, as it it always fun to have another self-serving HMB poseur to poke for the amusement of local citizens who really care about the place.


That stupid remark is uncalled for and not true. Apologize now!


NP, It is near my bedtime, but I welcome your taunt, and I, like you, am anonymous. For you to defend the status quo of this coastal community is an abomination. We lack all of the amenities of any coastal place in California. HMB does not own a square inch of playing fields. Midcoast has no meeting place, or public running water or toilets. How can you defend this place, NP? NP, do you really care about this place? really?


No.


Gotta hand it to you Steve, you hit a raw nerve with these PUDS. Brillant and really funny. And Buffoon, stop picking on Annette-no way to treat a lady.


Dave you are a gentleman and Steve you are a classy guy. I appreciate how you've helped the Coast all these years with your sound advice despite all these cruel attacks. You keep your cool and are very funny. Tony is lucky to have you. Bust those PUDS.


Sorry Annette. I thought you were Annette Buffoonacello. My mistake. I was wrong to jump to that conclusion based on what appeared to be your shameless flirtation with NP3 and what I thought was coy feigning of ignorance on land use issues. I see now that you are really a woman who runs with the wolves....


I don't run with wolfes, I ran with cougars and married one. But NP3 is a cute pud busting type of guy. HMB's new hero.


Another beautiful day on the Coast as the sun is rising over the PUDs. NP3 is basking in his splendor as he's getting so much attention from his legions of Pud Haters. Over the last few days, many PUD owners from other areas have chimmed in and expressed their anger about how badly they've been treated. There's a common thread to their stories.

This post has also taken an interesting and humorous turn of events by a few other commenting about other zoning abuses. I'm refering to one of the persons commenting about how she needed to get Dr. Dung to look for fosilized feces on her lot. Only could something like that happen here! What a joke.

I know I've taken a lot of cheap shots from the kiddies in the HMB Peanut gallery but the facts tell a different story. This particular post of No PUDS In HMB in just 8 short days have gotten over 1800 views on the world-renowned Talkabout and now is the 5th most heavily commented post and will move up easily today to #4 or #3. Who knows, it could also surpass #2, which was my first post on this subject which started on January 2, 2009.

In 3 short weeks, over 6000 people have read these 3 posts and 600 people have chimmed in. This topic shows how angry people are here about all the abuses of a system run amuck. People are sick of lawsuits, and endless apeals against families trying to build their dream home. And now we hear that people need to dig for turds on their property to make sure it doesn't come from the Flinstone Period. This has to stop and maybe NP3 is just the guy to help bring about the change we so desperately need.

Who knows what's in store for us today as the PUD Busters start to stir and express themselves. Let the fun begin. PUD Power is growing.


Steve, you're the man! This is to funny for words. Bust the Puds. Can we borrow NP3 for a while to bust the useless MCC? Guess he'd have to move to the MidCoast.


Wake up HMB. Stop screwing your people. People are getting angry, that means more trouble. Do something while you are still a city, even though its a poor excuse of one. Down with PUDS, up with froggie.


Dave, sorry but NP3 is a resident now of HMB and lives on RAilroad and Filbert and for some twisted reason wants to be Mayor. But his commrade, NP4 is available. I hear he lives on the site of the Miramar Green Bus and was instumental in the retro-fitting for the legions of PUD Busters.

Also feel free to modify my logo (6% royalty fee of course) for your use. How about changing the copy to read No MCC Coastside. If you need help let me know.


You are such a gentleman, Dave. I don't know why people are so mean here. It seems you can't have polite intelligent conversations. Instead you get insults. I'm very angry at the crude statements made about me and my ears and bikini. Totally uncalled for and cruel. Keep it up, Steve you are fighting for all of us. Hope you sell the lot and many more. God bless you for your words of wisdom.


You people are NUTS! I am so mad at what was done to my land with these puds. Now I hear you need some expert to study crap. City wants to study crap, I'll scrape off the 30 years of horse crap illegally dumped on my land and haul it down to City Hall. They can study it and the flies to.


No kidding. This place is in looney land. What a bunch of nuts. My Dad gave us this land decades ago so we could live here by the ocean. Don't know if I want to live near the crazy people like NP. I'd fear for my life. Look what you idiots did to your pretty little town.


It is so difficult to care about this town with all the issues and underhanded moves by the "governing" few regarding properties and building. Tom, you [and others] have been so seriously screwed by this town -- you have every right to be so upset. I don't know if your father is still alive but if he is, he must be lived about all this stuppidity and the creation of PUDs!

Oh yes and NP, you are indeed the prototypical idiot of our town! How sad is that. BTW, why did the town create that 50 ft wide conservation corridor on Railroad? If you know why then please tell us --- but actually, you probably don't know why either.


So sick of all these whining cry babies. Your land was rezoned so get over it. Now we can use it for pooping places for dogs and horses for free. Thank you and go away. Think you got a case, go sue or shut up.


The "PUD Lover" should thank all the PUD owners for having land that the PUD owners pay taxes on and for the PUD lovers to enjoy. You "PUD Lover" are a selfish individual, but you do have a right to express your views no matter how selfish they may be.


Its actually great to hear from people like pud lover. Its people with their views that have contributed to many of the problems we have here on the Coast. Their arrogance doesn't play well here anymore. Now if we can just fix this problem the easy way, that would be good for some of the long time owners above.


But Steve, where is NP? We haven't heard from him for a while; could he be off in some weed infested corner, sulking while he feeds the frogs and beats PUDs? Perhaps he is trying to come up with a new line other than asking if you have gotten any offers. Poor guy, may God have mercy on his lost and tortured spirit. Ya gotta love it, babe.


Hey, Hyman, even if your numbers claiming attention are as far off as your numbers usually are, I can see you are still getting a lot of attention from the riff-raff you have stirred up. But do these people have any money or property to trade? So much effort to promote your business, and specifically Tony's lot, and zero interest from buyers? This isn't going to work out well among people looking for a Realtor who knows what he/she is doing in these tough times for property sales. Hope one or more of the babblers are able to come through with some real action for you and not just more heated up display of their misunderstanding and lack of knowledge of PUDs, city zoning, Coastal Act and LCP considerations, and all the rest of the usual from HMB's confused and downtrodden lower cognitive classes.


What you clowns can't seem to get is that things changed. You blew your chance while you were to busy contemplating your navel. You snoozed and now you loose. These ordinances were changed and are now cast in concrete.

The frog/logo is an affront and totally stupid. How dare you make fun of endangered species. Grow up!


"...and all the rest of the usual from HMB's confused and downtrodden lower cognitive classes."

You are indeed a real gentleman NP and, a real politician who thinks he has a way with people and words. In fact, the problems and discontent that we have in HMB stem from minds like yours. It is time for you to leave this forum because you have not contributed anything positive nor will you in the future. I don't have any idea of your identity but hope that your are not part of the rule makers for our community or, perhaps you are and that would help to explain the mess that HMB is in.

I ask you again, please contibute to these discussions in a constructive way or excuse yourself from these blogs.


No "PUD Lover", you grow up, you are the clown. Just remember that change in the world was brought about by individuals who thought that change was possible and not by those who thought that change was impossible [or "in concrete" as you say]. We all make mistakes and perhaps we can try to fix them whether we are legislators or carpenters.

It would also help for you not express yourself in such a crude way. This is a medium for an exchange of ideas -- not a medium to insult people.


You guys up in HMB are more messed up than the nuts in Berkley and thats a tough act to follow. I thought this NP guy was over the top but this pud lover must have spent too much time living in the Berkley trees. I remember how cute this town was 30 years ago and fantasized about living up here by the beach. You idiots screwed it up for everybody. How sad.


Steve, NP3 really got all the kooks stirred up. No Pooping is bad but this PUD Hater guy is in a class by himself. Why does HMB attract such wierdos like this?

I'll email you off line, I want to modify your logo for the kooks up in this neck of the woods. Thanks, your fan.


"It is time for you to leave this forum because you have not contributed anything positive nor will you in the future."

And a great arbiter of discourse checks in. Excuse me while I bow from the ankles.

"You guys up in HMB are more messed up than the nuts in Berkley and thats a tough act to follow."

Comments from those with the experience and expertise necessary to make illuminating analogies are always appreciated. So the lower cognitive classes can understand and begin to educate themselves, where is the several-times-mentioned "Berkley."


Overheard through an open window near Railroad Avenue:

Lazy teen to parent: "I don't want to go to school today."

Parent: "Shut up and get your butt out of bed. Do you want to end up erecting signs for real estate agents?"


Let's stop screwing round with all this pc garbage. What HMB needs is Mike and Kevin at the helm. Let's get them back running this place and get things back to normal. All you PUD haters can then go pound salt or whatever strikes your demented fantasies.


PUD Lover is a troll.


No NP, from the "...souls". Thank you!


What a joke, bringing back Mike and Kevin. Why so they can put the last nail in the coffin. Its alway good to finish what you started, I guess. What a dump idea. LIke putting NP on MCC


Is April Fool's Day coming early this year? I agree what a joke.


Nice day today, if a little windy. Did Hyman get any action on Tony's lot on Railroad Avenue, perhaps from one of the cretins cheering on his embarrassing sales tactics on TalkAbout?


Hi Mr. Negative. Can't you once, pretty please make a point. Better would be to stay on topic. Do you like PUDS? Do you like the NP logo?


Amazing what we learn on Talkabout. Steve taught me about PUDS and you taught me about corpolite. Guess you are both experts in your respective fields.


Hey Bernie, I learned that new word too. It figures Mr. Negative would be an expert on carpolite. I knew if we looked deep enough, we'd find something. My mama told me everybody is good for something.


You PUD-pounders (still stunned to learn Annette has one) provide any offers of your own or sales leads to Hyman this evening?


Buuuu Buuuuu Buuuuu Buffunicello!!!!!!!1


Web Link


Looks like it will be another spectacular day as the sun rises over the Coast's PUDS. Yesterday was another victorious day for the PUD Busters as they gained more attention on many fronts.

Yesterday another 250 people read about the trails of NP3 and his followers propelling this post to now #4 on Talkabout most viewed list and should easily move to #3, right behind my first post which is #2.

There were more angry remarks from out of area PUD owners as well as the usual insults from the masked kiddies sitting in the cheap seats of the HMB Peanut Gallery. Their insults, as usual, are off topic and add nothing but weak humor. LIke the dieing gasps of a boxer on the ropes before the KO punch.

What was gratifying was to have Dave have me modify the NO PUDS logo for another use- No MCC Coastside. I have to give credit to my son who did the computer artwork from digitizing the locally purchased frog protecting my For Sale sign. In just a few short hours yesterday, over 225 people viewed this post.

What these posts show, including the Dump MCC, is there is a very strong and growing undercurrent of anger among the residents about how this place is run and how poorly the residents are treated. This isn't going away. Quite the contrary, its growing rapidly.

And who would think all this rage was uncorked with the knocking down of a For Sale sign.


Hey Steve, mucho thanks for letting me use your logo. Thanks also to your talented son for doing the artwork. In a few short hours, this logo really pissed off all the backers of the status quo. Many people never heard of PUDS-love the name-but hate them already in a few weeks. Everybody knows the MCC and already hates them so my campaign should gain traction fast. Sups hates them too.


Steve Hyman # 2 and 3 on the Talkabout most viewed list.

Steve Hyman #1 on the realtor to never use list.


This is first time I've seen this and an amazed how you people shoot the messenger. Mr. Hyman is giving informed info yet some of the writers are insulting and over the top. Hope Mr. Hyman ignores these types and keeps doing what he's doing. These puds should be fixed. This is not right what HMB did to many people!


I have decided to start a countermovement: SPUD, for Save (our) Planned Unit Development (zoning). Our mission statement is to educate the public on issues related to Planning and Zoning

Our logo will be a potato.


Mr. SPUD MAN please educate me about why we need PUDS. My family owns 7 puds for over 30 years. All I know is my plans to build my home has been blocked for decades. Why is this good for me? In over 200 comments, no one has presented a positive reason for this and the conservation easement.

Also don't know why all the mean comments to Mr. Hyman. He seems like the only sane person here. I want to learn today about PUDS. Thank you very much Mr. SPUD MAN.


PUDS v SPUDS. Sounds like a HMB comic strip from Mad Magazine. Frog eats potatoe, game over. PUDS win!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Very astute comment "gramps". His name came up in our neighborhood as two residents on our street are preparing to put their homes on the market. They have selected different realtors.


Why are people so mean? Steve how do you deal with all these mean comments. You are a tough guy.


Mr. SPUD MAN. Its been over 2 hours since you said you were going to educate us on PUDS. I'm hungry for knowledge and some good fries.


Nobody better be planting spuds or whatever on my puds. Its bad enough I got 2 feet of horse crap on my property that now some expert is going to want to study for $5k. You people up north are beyond help.


As Hyman further blows away any last positive vestiges of his reputation, are any of his friends trying to alleviate his misery with offers on Tony's lot on Railroad Avenue. Focus, losers, focus.

Not only will you be helping Hyman, you'll be helping Tony, who has to be wondering whether or not his lot is as worthless as the lack of sales activity seems to indicate.


Mr. SPUDMAN its now 4 hours and I'm still hungry to learn what you know. Maybe you know nothing unlike Mr. Hyman who speaks facts. Tell me about my PUDS.


These related threads are many days old, yet no offers on Tony's lot after all the babble. First things first. Help poor Steven, even if he seems not of this planet with all his misuse of terms, erroneous numbers, inability to focus, violation of ethics, and avoidance of the genesis and development of PUDs in Half Moon Bay.


Mr. SPUDMAN its now 5 hours since you boasted about educating us on PUDS and you haven't even written a 5 word sentence. What a BS artist. Anyway this topic has got me so bummed that I'm taking up pudhaters idea. I'm going home now to sautee some frog legs in garlic and wash it down with a fifth of JD an forget about you kooks in HMB.

Maybe by tomorrow you'll come up with an original thought as to why I should be happy about getting screwed by HMB. What a pile of carpolite you are. Hey I learned something from HMB. What a fitting word for you clowns.


Dear Tom,

Spudman is not concerned by how many Earth-hours have elapsed since his previous posting.

SpudMan has decided to re-post an earlier comment from this thread, in the interest of providing more relevant informaton about planning, zoning and how it may relate to land use.

"Planned Unit Development zoning is sometimes used to accomplish various land-use goals. An example of this would be to create higher density housing on a large site, so that other portions of the site can be used for different purposes."


Spudman sez: Read Wikipedia Web Link

What is a PUD?

Planned Unit Development is a means of land regulation which promotes large scale, unified land development by means of mid-range, realistic programs in chase of physically-curable, social and economic deficiencies in land and cityscapes. Where appropriate, this development control promotes:

A mixture of both land uses and dwelling types with at least one of the land uses being regional in nature

The clustering of residential land uses providing public and common open space

Increased administrative discretion to a local professional planning staff while setting aside present land use regulations and rigid plat approval processes

The enhancement of the bargaining process between the developer and government municipalities which in turn strengthens the municipality’s site plan review and control over development for potentially increased profits due to land efficiency, multiple land uses, and increased residential densities.

Frequently, PUDs take on a variety of forms ranging from small clusters of houses combined with open spaces to new and developing towns with thousands of residents and various land uses. However, the definition of a PUD does not take into consideration these types of developments unless they fit into a category of size ranging from 100 acres (0.40 km2) to 2,500 acres (10 km2). In a PUD the property owner owns the land the dwelling sits on.


SPUDMAN that sounds like some weaslily lawyer sentence. Get specific about my PUD. So if you actually know what youre saying (sounds like you lifted it from some primer) I can break up my 6500 & 7500 square foot lots into condos for higher density. Yippee I can make more money. Tell me more tomorrow. This gives you all night to get specific. Gotta sautee some legs now.


Tom:

SpudMan does not wish to become familiar with your PUD and has respectfully declined your request to: "Get specific about my PUD."


Hey Spudman you're mission statement says is "to educate the public on issues of Planning and Zoning". Tom asked a simple question. Your first responce to a direct question is to "not get specific with his specific PUD and declined to comment". How can you educate if you won't answer questions.

If that's your approach to dialogue you come up way short in comparison to Steve. Bad start to your campaign. You just got mashed on opening move. Talkabout is a tough place-no mulligans here.


David,

Spudman is not afraid of TalkAbout. Let me simplify this for you. SpudMan is using humour and has made a pun out of Tom's request. "PUD" had more than one meaning, you can look it up. Henceforth SpudMan will refer to Planned Unit Developements by their full name, to avoid any confusion.

Tom,

Did you read the Spudmans posting above, and do you understand the meaning of the words "large scale"? SpudMan knows what he is saying. You do not know what you are saying. You cannot break up your small individual parcels to create a Planned Unit Development. They can, however be combined with other parcels for this same purpose.

Spudman has many powers and is capable of answering multiple questions at once.


OK, OK, spudsmen are red-hot... I agree, but ombudsmen mediate local disputs, hello, that would be me.

In this case I work for an NGO, and peace be with you...


Ombudsmen,

Please help SpudMan meditate with local despots.


Spudman,

How dare you hijack Hyman's bleat for attention in order to sell Tony's lot on Railroad Avenue?

The boys in the playground band aren't going to like your actual definitions and background on PUDs. The land-use kind of PUDs, that is. They would rather circle up and pound their own version, as you have seen with Tom.

It's rude of you to treat children this way. And it only opens Steven up to more ridicule when all he is trying to do is bring in a little commission.


SPUDMAN You actually sound wise, my appologies for being short with you. Please help me with my PUD. My dad bought many lots in 1960's, now own 9 in between Central and Correas. Several are up against City land. These lots are owned by many, no developer. Less than 100 acres, depending how divide land.

What will happen here. Also I just learned on this Railroad Ave 50 foot easement. Why was it done and how benefits me? Help I want to build my dream house on the bluff. What do I need to do?


Tom,

SpudMan accepts your apology and offers the following advice:

Look elsewhere to build your dreamhome. The blufftop and these parcels are unlikely to be developed. Many of the large lots on the Western boundary of this area are owned by the County will not be developed.

Instead, consider the tax benefits of making a donation of your land to a local land trust. Remember that none of this land is buildable, and changing the zoning will not change that fact. This is something that Mr. Hyman does not understand. Between Railroad and the Coastal Trail there are no streets, no sewers and no utilities.

SpudMan understands your frustration and will continue to provide factual information to this forum.

Web Link" width="379" height="483"/>


Although SpudMan is experiencing technical difficulties, he offers this partial map for your review:

Web Link


I want no PUDS in HMB.


Thank you SPUDMAN. Many of lots in my area are owned by individuals and are small. Some back up to City land. My dad told me area was subdivided in early 1900's. Paper streets exisit but utilities need to be extended from Central and Correas.

Sounds like City rezoned my land to make it worthless. PLease also explain reason for easement and how that helps me. If City made my property useless isn't that a property taking. My dad's attorney mentioned that after he died.


Dear SpudMan,

Some of the concern seems to be about access to lots that might produce commissions for Hyman. People who prefer to let others tell them what it is all about have come to believe in their saggy-faced way that there is no route to their private property across the open-space Railroad Avenue right-of-way.

Is it true that property may not be sold, subdivided, or combined nor boundaries redrawn so as to landlock someone else's parcel?


I'm so glad you came forward Spudman to shed light on these old mysteries. Perhaps you'd be kind enough to share with us your long term knowledge or opinions on some past practices.

I'm referring to a past client of mine who owned a small home on a 3 acre parcel across from Frenchman's Creek in a 8-9 parcel 50 acre PUD. I can't understand why the City would write specific zoning for that one house stating it could not be expanded by 1 sqft. No additions or second home. I spoke to mayor, city manager and planning director with 60 year owner and none could give a reason for this unfair practice. City did offer to rectify the situation by offering to buy the home for 30% of its market value. Owner did decline City's offer.

Why did they do that? If you don't know, I'd welcome your educated opinion. Thanks.


"If you don't know, I'd welcome your educated opinion."

Yeah, to heck with facts. Wing it when a commission might be at stake.

When may we look forward to the publication of "Little Stories Oft-Repeated" by Steven Hyman?


If NP cannot answer the most simple question, NP sucks and should quit posting.

Steve, you rock, man. Kep those questions coming.


SpudMan offers factual information and does not claim to know why certain planning decisions were made in the pas. He does remember a small house, next to a (smelly) horse stable, that was sold several years ago for what seemed to be a reasonable price at the time.

Web Link

Please restate your question.

Thank you,

SpudMan


The question was directed to Spudman. He seems willing to answer questions which is something you never do np. I asked many at City Hall including the big cheeses and couldn't get an answer as to why this punitive zoning was done to these 60 year residents.

Facts are always preferred but its ancient history. Your educated guess would be interesting to hear as a fallback.


Do you think there might be a family hour TV series based on Hyman's "Little House on the Coastside"? He can't drum up any sales activity among the property rights plodders of HMB, but national exposure....

Good night, Steve Steve.


does hyman have a wife?

she must be lonely. he spends a whole bunch of time on the sell. soon we'll be #1 talkabout seven!


Spudman, your memory is impressive although the link is not the house in question or sale price. It is next to the stable and sold for $800,000 and was very hard to sell because of restrictive zoning prohibiting any expansion of the home whatsoever even though there were no setback issues. Nobody at City Hall could give a reason why the owner was so punished but they were as are the current owners.

I'm curious why anybody would do that? I'd welcome your opinion if you don't know the real answer. City HAll, as I said, couldn't offer a reason other than appeal it to the CC. Not something an 80 year old widow wanted to do.


There are ten thousand stories in the punishing city. This has been one of them.

Will you have a local signing of "Little Stories..." when it comes out, Steven?


SpudMan is pleased to inform Mr. Hyman, a real estate professional, that Zillow.com provides an automated estimate of the valuation of a property and NOT the sales price.

Please review this weblink again, and use your mouse to move from left-to-right. There is small house on the property, next to a stable.

Web Link


Thank you Spudman. That is the house although the estimate seems very high to me considering the zoning. I don't always remember exact addresses of homes I sold years ago.

But please provide me with your comments on the zoning question? It stumped City Hall Brass. That hard to do.


Look Steve. There are some nice people here. Glad to see not everyone is as mean as Mr. Negative. That makes me so happy.


Another beautiful day in PUD land with much to report. The big news is after 250 comments here was the emergence of SPUDMAN and the potato logo. SPUD stands for Save PUDS and is a counter movement to my NO PUDS in HMB and NP3 and his legion of PUD busters. What an interesting match this will be. No PUDS v. SPUDS. Sounds like a great comic and lawsuit too.

Spudman has been providing some facts to the mysteries surrounding these PUDS but is only willing "to offer factual information but does not claim to know why certain planning and zoning decisions were made in the past". That unfortunately doesn't answer the big questions effecting people's properties and their diminished rights.

This post continues to gain traction by moving up to #2 on the world renowned Talkabout list and has been viewed 7000 times now for all 3 posts.

To keep it short I'll respond to 2 issues seperately I'd like to further discuss to Spudman. We should all be grateful that he choose to engage us.


The Arletta Park/Alsace Lorainne PUDS have already been subdivided around 100 years ago with paper streets (some people know and others they don't). The City zoning says that this area can be built once a master plan is submitted to the City for approval which will include building streets, sidewalks and utilities. The operative words are master plan.

To organize all the many property owners is a big task and getting them to pay for the infastructure only makes the task harder. This will take a long time.

BUt this area is too nice and potentially expensive to leave the way it is for free. The drumbeat for development will get louder as more of these lots turn over at higher prices. In the past few years I've sold lots here, prices went from $45,000 to $90,000.

What will also make this area easier to develop is because of the weakened state of the City's finances from foolishly squandering millions on legal fees only to get hammered with the Keenan judgment. They won't have the money for future battles from hundreds of angry PUD owners demanding their rights. Its like a fighter who punches himself out in the 2nd round and is out of gas when there are many more rounds to go.

There are also many other PUDS in HMB that will be easier to develop because of smaller groups of owners. Some PUDS have 3 and 8 parcels.

Sure owners could donate land to HMB for a tax write-off but why. Tom sold 3 lots for over $250,000 cash. Wouldn't have gotten that from a write-off. He also wasn't going to donate for free to the people who he felt screwed him. I know Tom, he's my client.

The PUDS are going down. Not today or next year but over time. The PUD movement got a big shot in the arm from the immature actions taken by some extreme fringe elements of the Save our View crowds who knocked down Tony's For Sale sign twice. Amazing how such a small thing can mushroom into something much larger.


SpudMan provides this comment on your statement that:

"The PUDS are going down."

The Planned Unit Development Zoning is here to stay. Your efforts to change over 100 years of zoning history have become become quite flaccid.

(Enough with the Freudian slips: Is SpudMan the only one here who knows the slang meaning of "PUD"? It is not pretty. Please call them Planned Unit Developments. )


I know putz. The only PUD I know is here. Please keep shareing your knowledge with us SPUDMAN about what a PUD is? You may need to keep the language clean. I'm afraid that the yougens may mistake the colorful frog as a comic. Though this post is very funny. Thanks.


Very very funny Spudman. Hard to believe that PUD could have so many uses. Guess I've been doing real estate too long. Some of the other uses also apply to my logo.


OMG, I'm blushing from one of the other meaning of PUDS! I can't believe people do that. I won't show that to my husband. I'll just think about our cute frog and forget I saw that.


SPUDMAN thanks again for your comments. I know if I wait long enough, my families lots will be buildable. We should have built our homes back in the 70's. Pisses me off because we never blocked people from building on Correas and Central and now these people are screwing me.

The last thing I would ever do is donate this to the City who screwed me. I sold a few for some good money so why give it to these morons. I'll get the last laugh when my home is up on Correas. That's the beauty of getting it cheap with low taxes.

My Dad's lawyer said this is a property taking. What do you think?


"BUt this area is too nice and potentially expensive to leave the way it is for free. The drumbeat for development will get louder as more of these lots turn over at higher prices. In the past few years I've sold lots here, prices went from $45,000 to $90,000."

How is your sales prowess working for Tony's lot after all this attention we have provided to you? Is one of the property rights plodders finally showing interest in buying to help you out?

"The PUDS are going down. Not today or next year but over time. The PUD movement got a big shot in the arm from the immature actions taken by some extreme fringe elements of the Save our View crowds who knocked down Tony's For Sale sign twice. Amazing how such a small thing can mushroom into something much larger."

So big not a single reported offer on Tony's lot so far? Fill us in, because it looks like a lot of nutcases venting gas unless you get somewhere with the strategy.

May we assume the "Save Our View" bunch is an eco-terrorist cell, at least according to whatever definition you have personally cooked up for "eco-terrorism"? So illuminating this lexicon for the 21st Century, or Century 21 as some refer to it.


SpudMan,

It is best to stick with one definition of a word or phrase at a time for the HMB PUD pounders. Richness of language is as confusing as biodiversity to them and only serves to further lower their self-esteem. They have enough trouble seeing as it is, witness the ever-constricting circle in the corner of the playground where they exercise for the benefit of one another.


One lovely coastside day after another. With all the visitors to the coastside adding to the local population, is Hyman getting any bites on Tony's lot on Railroad Avenue?

If no buyers, and at this stage of the game, he has been so self-defeating with all his goofy and erroneous messages on TA that he probably would more than welcome some kindly action from HMB "loosers." How about it? Are all of you misdirected babblers circled up on the playground broke?


Where's SPUDMAN? He appeared and vanished. I still got unanswered questions. Is this a property taking? What is the reason for the conservation easement? I think it is to block access to my land. Please answer SPUDMAN. We are hungry for answers.


Why would you ask anonymous Mr. SpudMan about takings law when you can look it up for yourself or hire a constitutional law expert to explain it to you for your particular property. (In the meantime, if not all uses have been eliminated from your bare property, a change in zoning is probably not a taking. If you think all uses have been eliminated, you should press your rights legally.)

Access to your property cannot be blocked legally.

So, be happy. Do what is permitted on your property. Or list your property with Hyman and see if oblique fiction works as an attention-getting sales technique. If you need inspiration, check on this and related threads to see how our numbers-challenged Realtor storyteller is doing with Tony's lot on Railroad Ave.


Now Mr. Negative is speaking for Mr. Spudman. I guess that makes you a spudsspokesman. Haha. Where did Mr. Spudman disapppear to? Did he get mashed?


I respond to Coastside Rednecks as a public service. Mr. SpudMan probably has much more constructive things to do.

So, late in another great day, and still no word from Hyman on a sale of the lot on Railroad Avenue. He must be busy organizing all the offers for review by Tony, eh what?


All in good time. Mr Hyman is doing his job. Tony will get his lot sold.


So good to hear. We would all hate to think Hyman's self-immolation of what little credibility he had left has gone without a commission.


SpudMan is waiting for new material.


In 30 days, these 3 posts have not only hit a nerve but have gotten a lot of attention. 7000 views and 700 comments shows people are interested in property rights issues, even if its not the most pressing matter facing the coast.

What started out as knocking down a For Sale sign by the Save Our View crowd has turned into maybe the beginning of a movement to reclaim our diminished property rights. One person even borrowed the No PUDS logo and modified it for some other use.

So after 3 weeks, the most fortified For Sale sign on the Coast is proudly still standing guarded by NP3, our property rights crusader. He too has remained intact.

It was interesting hearing from PUD owners both here and off-line. There stories are the same. Its also amusing seeing how the Coast's wild pitcher has been reduced to endlessly repeating himself with the same silly questions. For now this has been wildly successful but it has run its course. There are other issues out ther. Of course, if NP3 is attacked and brutalized, the next installment is in the can and ready to go. Thanks. This has been fun.


Steve, you kicked some good PUD. I loved all the comments an your humor. Thanks again for giving me the No MCC logo. That's working great.


There's nothing funny about this. HMB screwed my family with this stupid pud zoning. The horse crap on my land only makes me madder. I don't know who this NP jerk is but he's why you are messed up.


You are a very funny guy Steve. I'm still laughing over NP3 and he's so darn cute and colorful. Mr. Negative is weird, think he's got crush on you. I do too and you are better looking


I'm with you pud hater, HMB is screwed up. They are crazier than Berkley and that is tough to beat. I still can't get over some nut suggesting I donate my land to HMB after being screwed. That is the stupidest thing I've heard in years. Poor HMB you are in trouble.


Poor Steven. After all our good wishes and crossed fingers, it is obvious another day has gone by without his goal of gleaning a commission from sale of Tony's lot on Railroad Avenue being reached.

C'mon PUD pounders. Break from it for a few minutes and get an offer in to him. His delusions have reached the point that he thinks he is starting a social movement with the few of you. At this stage of the game, necessary psychotherapy for him won't be cheap.


Why do you keep picking on Steve Mr. Negative. He's helping people. As far as shrinking goes, its you who needs extensive treatment. Don't you like the frog with NP on it? He's so cute and colorful.


The low cognitive functioning crowd continue to chase their tails as a substitute for real ideas. NP, I appreciate your persistence, but it's really wasted on these bozos. I only keep checking this thread because I'm worried about you.


NP - don't try to deny that you and "you are too good..." are not one and the same person. That pompous, condescending arrogance cannot be duplicated. The vocabulary and adjectives that flow fromt he same attitude...talking to yourself again, right? This is either intentional or you are schizophrenic; maybe a little of both. Certainly nobody else agrees with you.


"Why do you keep picking on Steve Mr. Negative. He's helping people."

All the help we actually have seen from Hyman so far is help for the whimsy-inspired to make fools of themselves. Certainly, Tony has not been helped a bit by the lack of action on the Railroad Avenue lot after all the attention we have helped to provide in response to Hyman's fairy tales about PUDs and frogs.

But we haven't lost hope. If Hyman is able to help Tony or one of the other owners of PUD lots that were created in the first place to boost land exploitation around here, we will be among the first to support his application for Alice in Wonderland Realtor of the Year. Too bad for Steven that none of his fellow vocal dreamlanders have been willing to put their money where their mouth is so far.


NP - we could put our money where YOUR mouth is but nobody has enough to fill it.


You seem distracted, probably misdirected, wee wemoan. Those ammonia fumes on the job getting to you? Hyman needs the money much worse than I judging by his flailing. So truck on down to Century 21 and get your deposit down on that great lot of Tony's on Railroad Ave. Escrow can't start until someone stops being an enabler and making excuses for failure to pay attention and gets their wallet out. A commission or two, and Hyman might be able to get back to his old, more dignified sales routines for selling to people who can't afford it.


Nr. Negative, you must have been an unhappy child. Please stop picking fights. Thank you. The frog is so cute


Just because NP posts everywhere all the time, please NOTE there is no substance to his comments--just ignore her.


Hey, here's something we can all agree on! This thread has gone on (and on and on) long enough. It's been silly for days so I'm going to stop it. Thanks for playing.


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